Traveller-digest       Tuesday, June 24 1997       Volume 1997 : Number 1472



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

[none]
Re: Characteristic vs. Skill claim
Re: Editions and Mechanics comments
Re: Anders FUDGES a Task System
Re: Latest Vote Count
Re: Deckplan Question?
Re: Deckplan Question?
Re:Minimum TL for...
Re: Deckplan Question?
Re: Deckplan Question?
Re: Deckplan Question?
Re: Eris Task System Suggestion
Re: Vote Count
Re: Meta-facts?
Re: TrTools v0.93
Re: T4 tasks, again (sorry)
Re: Putting Traveller on an upward trend
Re: T4 Task Rationale
MT Task Library
Re: T4 Task Rationale
Re: Task System, Game Design, etc.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 10:55:17 -0800
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@asylumbbs.com>
Subject: [none]

>If what I wrote above offended you, or anyone else, then I apologize for
>the offense, but not for the opinion.  I don't evangalize my ideas very
>often or very much, like some people <g>, but I *will* express them.

Eris: It WAS meant to be provocative! Not to be offensive... hence the
quotes...

It was also meant to point out the difference in the TNE mindset
(Mechanics, not BG). TNE skills were on par with what most complain about
T4's.

>>changing the value of skill level x is going to be annoying.
>
>William, that has already happened in T4.  Two is no longer an Average
>skill level, it's three or four.  Four is no longer an Expert, that's gone
>up to five or six.  Even Marc is talking about Demolitions-9, for heaven's
>sake! <g>

In 30 T4 characters generated, Even allowing 1 skill per term to be picked,
I've NEVER seen a skill higher than 5!!! NEVER!!! The skill levels I have
seen tend to cluster around 2, +-1; just more of them than in previous
editions.

If anyone was offended, my apologies...


William F. Hostman		If you were using Eudora Lite 3.0,
Mailto:Aramis@asylumbbs.com 	<-- that would be a hot-link 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:24:42 -0800
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: Characteristic vs. Skill claim

Tue, 24 Jun 1997 09:08:55 -0800,  Richard Hough <rdhough@orca.bc.ca>

>First of all, characteristics can range from 1 to 15.

The fact is that if 2.8% of the characters start with
stat of 2 and 100% of them start with a skill of 0.  Then
for most players the range for stat is not down to 2 but
it is down to 0 for skills....

>In the character
>generation system it is very easy to get characteristics above 11.

I agree that is it shouldn't be very easy to get characteristics above
11 in the character generation system.

>Secondly, skill levels are both non-linear and don't have as wide an
>effective range as characteristics.

See my previous post...
  Characters typically have many skills

>>The only reason Dex 7 and skill 4 vs Dex 11 and
>>skill 1 is seen as a problem is the desire to
>>see skill weighted more heavily than stats.  But
>>that is matter of personal opinion.

>It is not merely an "opinion" that the current task system is unbalanced.

Well, yes it is.  Everything said here is an opinion.  Additionally,
the above comment was directed at the point that some make that
someone with training should be able to beat out someone with
talent (No matter how hard that talent is to get).  That is
also definately an opinion.  There are a lot of skill+stat
systems out there and many of them are very popular.  It
would be arrogant to call all of them broken.

>A separate issue is the fact that, in T4 currently, it is as easy to get a
>characteristic increase through character generation as it is to get a
>skill increase

I agree this is a mistake.  I would say that a simple
change would be to require a player to save up two or
three rolls that could be applied else where to make
one roll on the stat table.

_______________________________________________________________
DSummers@Mail.ARC.NASA.gov

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 97 13:18:42 -0500
From: eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)
Subject: Re: Editions and Mechanics comments

On 06/24/97 at 01:59 AM,  hdhale@siscom.net (Harold Hale) said:

>Cluster      /   # of skills

>Strength     /      14

>Agility      /      21

>Constitution /      12

>Intelligence /      20

>Education    /      26

>Charisma     /      14

Maybe you'd like a comparison with T4...

One of the
Controlling         Number of
Attributes           Skills
==========          =========
STR                     7
DEX                    31
END                     6
INT                    46
EDU                    37
SOC                    12

INT is so high because it is listed as a possible controlling attribute for
skills all over the place.  It certainly *seems* less balanced than TNE on
first glance.

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 97 13:00:57 -0500
From: eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)
Subject: Re: Anders FUDGES a Task System

On 06/24/97 at 08:08 AM,  anders.backman@aniware.se (Anders Backman) said:

>>This system works nicely and can be adapted to Traveller in many
>>different ways, but it is *so* different, I wouldn't dream of suggesting
>>Marc use something like this in T41.  ;->

>About the names of tasks/skills I think it is important to keep the names
>of skills and equivalent tasklevels similar ie:
>Extremely inexperienced  Extremely easy
>Very Inexperienced       Very easy etc

I just put them side by side on the character sheet and run my finger up
and down betweeen them.  After a few minutes doing that it becomes second
nature.

>My biggest gripe about FUDGE is that there is no tasklevel that is about
>50%. 

That's true, and it bothers me too.  Increasing the number of fudge dice
doesn't solve that problem either.  I checked as high as 7 and the jump
from -1 to 0 was still about 44% to 58%.  I still use Fudge style
resolution for the quick and dirty rolls, reserving a more detailed
Traveller style resolution for cases where the difference in a point makes
a big difference.

>I've tried a tasksystem that gave Joe Average 6+ on 2D6 on Normal
>tasks and we played an entire boarding action with that and later refought
>it with 7+ instead. The differance in feel was quite large and both my
>players and me agreed on 7+ being superior.

Yes, the difference should be very easy to see.  The difference is 42%
compared to 58%, and a 16% difference is quite significant.  If we go from
2 to 3 dice, though, we do have a 50% breakpoint at 10- or 11+.

Personally, if we move from a variable number of dice to a fixed set, I'd
prefer using 3 dice over 2. The range of probabilities is much better.

Eris
- -- 
- -----------------------------------------------------------
eris@pen.net (Eris Reddoch)    using MR/2 ICE #245
- -----------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Jun 1997 12:52:04 +1100
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <gtrupert@iconz.co.nz>
Subject: Re: Latest Vote Count

Hi, I haven't previously written onthis subject, as I'm generally 
pretty happy with my version of TNE, but I can't resist any 
longer.

My personal perference would be for a TNE style D20 system, but 
mainly because the way tasks divide or multiply assests means that, 
unlike systems that add or sutract DMs, even experts can fail average 
tasks, and novices make very hard tasks. The effect of the success 
levels in 2300AD and MT is why I don't really like the task systems 
in those games.

IMO the variable dice system of T4 and variants (including the 
KBv2.0) recreate this nicely, but it's also important that SS and SF 
chances change with either the task's difficulty or the overall 
success chance (as they did in MT and TNE).

I do belive that stats are overly important in skill based tasks, as 
the one time I played in a T4 game my sniper with a Dex 7 (from 
ageing) and skill 6 was out classed in his specialty by a pilot with 
a Dex 11 and skill 3. Fortunatly we went back to MT's task system and 
I could actually claim to be a master shot and not get laughed at by 
the young punks. Even TNE's system can get this way, and IME it's not 
as pro-stat weighted as T4 is.

For those who are interested my TNE system down-rates the importance 
of initiative, and uses T4 style variability of stat. I'm thinking of 
altering the importance of stats, as well.

R. Boleyn <gtrupert@iconz.co.nz>

TNE to the Core

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Jun 1997 12:52:04 +1100
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <gtrupert@iconz.co.nz>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

Bruce Johnson wrote:

> On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Peter H. Brenton wrote:
> 
> [snip]
> 
> > Well, if you want to get technical remember;
> > 
> > 1). Both 13.5 m^3 and 14 m^3 are approximations to begin with.  I'll leave
> > it to more chemically oriented heads to decide exactly how many m^3 are in
> > a displacement ton of Hydrogen (or is it Deuterium?...and what about water
> > before refining?)
> 
> Well, according to my handy Merck's Index, H2 has a density of 0.07 g/cm^3
> at it's boiling point, going up to 0.076 (or therabouts) as a solid. I
> doubt that they store H2 in solid form on starships given the pressure
> requirements, so I'll use the bp density figure.
> 
> A displacement ton is defined as the volume that 1000 kg of LHyd takes up.
> 
> So, therefore, 1 Td = 1000 kg * (1000 g/kg) * (1 cm^3/0.07g) *
> (1m^3/1e^6 cm^3) = 14.28 m^3. So the FFS figure of 14 is actually the
> correct number if you round to the nearest whole m^3.
> 
> Haven't a clue where they got the 13.5 m^3 number, but by the definition,
> 14 is the correct number, and the number SHALL NOT be 13.5 UNLESS thou
> proceedest on to 14. 15 is right out! 

I'm pretty sure from my MT days that 13.5 m^3 was used because MT 
used 3 m as the vertical distance between decks. Given 3 m high decks 
13.5 m^3 gives two of the standard 1.5 m^2 grid squares per 
displacement ton.

IIRC FF&S used 2 m^2 grid squares and a 3.5 m deck seperation. This 
gives one grid square per displacement ton (and about 3 m between 
decks for neat access ways and crawl spaces).

R. Boleyn <gtrupert@iconz.co.nz>

TNE to the Core

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 97 19:26:08 -0600
From: Glenn Hoppe <starcity@sk.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

On 1997-06-24 15:55 thus spake Bruce Johnson:

>Haven't a clue where they got the 13.5 m^3 number, but by the definition,
>14 is the correct number, and the number SHALL NOT be 13.5 UNLESS thou
>proceedest on to 14. 15 is right out! 

LOL. I take it you pulled that quote from the revered book, _The Holy 
Naval Architects Guide_.

>A displacement ton of LH2 in the form of water, on the other hand is a bit
>harder to figure out. One displacement ton of H2, purified (we'll assume
>we mean chemical, not isotopic purity) is 1000 kg * (1000 g/kg) * 
>(1mole/2g) = 500,000 moles of dihydrogen.
>
>1 mole of water = 1 mole of LH2 = 18 g
>
>500,000 moles H20 * 18 g/Mole = 9e^6 g water. Fortunately, water is
>another of our great constants so that 1 g H20 is 1 cm^3, so 9e^6 g H2O =
>9 m^3 of water. 
>
>Unfortunately, that 9 m^3 of water weighs 14 times what the hydrogen does.
>
>Amazing what lugging around useless oxygen will do!

Useless? What the heck do *you* breathe? :)


- -- 
===== Glenn Hoppe =====\ /--- MailTo:jumpspace@geocities.com ----
\ . . Enter Jumpspace --X-> http://www.geocities.com/Area51/8275 \
 ----------------------/ \========== Eschew Obfuscation ==========

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:39:15 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re:Minimum TL for...

At 08:09 am 06/23/97 GMT, you wrote:
>	Can any one point me to a site on Lighter Than Air craft?  Or better
>yet, is the new FF&S going to cover LTA craft?

	It was in the manuscript ...
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
   goldendj@pcisys.net                       finger for PGP key
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:10:52 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

At 04:42 pm 06/23/97 -0600, you wrote:
>*Two* 1.5 m squares = 6.75 * 2 = 13.5 m = 1 Displacement Ton

	1 displacement ton is 14m3, not 13.5. That crept in with MT.
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:29:37 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

At 02:55 pm 06/24/97 -0700, you wrote:
>Haven't a clue where they got the 13.5 m^3 number, but by the definition,

	Because it's easy to say that a half ton is one square, if you use 1.5m
squares and a 3m deck ...

- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:08:49 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

At 11:15 pm 06/23/97 +0100, you wrote:
>Two squares = 13.5 m3, based on a deck-to-deck height of 3 m.
>
>Two squares = 1.5 x 3 x 3 = 1.5 x 9 = 13.5 m3
>
>Thus a 100 T vessel has 200 squares on its deck plan.

	Assuming, of course, that you define 1 displacement ton as 13.5m3. Which
MT did for convenience, but it's really 14m3.
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:51:37 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Eris Task System Suggestion

At 04:17 am 06/23/97 -0800, you wrote:
>Again, here I agree whole heartedly. T4's saving grace is Marc's decision
>early on to try and keep it compatable with CT/MT. Eris and the "TNE
>Heretics" never were on par with CT/MT, and to them it may not be
>important... but to those who kept the flame for over a decade, changing
>the value of skill level x is going to be annoying.

	Hrm? I always felt that skills in TNE had more-or-less the same value as
in CT/MT ... And I've been keeping the flame for near two decades ...
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
   goldendj@pcisys.net                       finger for PGP key
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 "He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his
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  a precedent that will reach to himself" -- Thomas Paine

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:45:01 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Vote Count

At 12:12 pm 06/23/97 MET, you wrote:
>
>Voting for T4.1 with revisions or variants thereof:
>Voting for KBv2.0 (or other KB variants or similar systems) were:
>Voting for a system along the lines of MT (or variants thereof):
>(or just preferring it!)
>TNE-like D20 system
>Other votes generally in favor of change (no specific system)

	Please add my vote as follows:

	0.5: Generally in favor of change (no specific system)
	0.3: MT or variant
	0.2: TNE-like d20

	What? I can't split my vote? Well, then put me in the MT bucket, I guess
... I do want a system with a fixed number of dice, and a d20 system, much
as I'd like it, seems right out.
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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 "He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his
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  a precedent that will reach to himself" -- Thomas Paine

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:40:49 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Meta-facts?

At 09:28 am 06/23/97 +0100, you wrote:

>I suspect the reason there are so many refs without players on TML and
>elsewhere is that Traveller unlike other RPG (with the possible exception
>of Harn) didn't tell the ref the facts but rather hinted at them and put
>the ref in the players position regarding the truths about the universe.
>The old Keith adventures were like that as well; good to read as fiction as
>well as good adventures. The DGP nugget format destroyed that but I still
>think that if Traveller had told the ref what the Ancients were, if
>Strephon really was a robot, that the 5:th frontier war was coming the game
>would have a lot less referees.
>The only good thing with TNE (except the rules) was that they didn't tell
>what was behind the black curtain.

	Oh, I don't want to know _everything_ about the plot line for the next
five years. But I would appreciate it matching with what I've already
learned about the plotline from the last FIFTEEN years.
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
   goldendj@pcisys.net                       finger for PGP key
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 "He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:23:49 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: TrTools v0.93

Yo! I'd like a copy, please ...

At 07:15 pm 06/24/97 +0800, you wrote:
>Tired of wimpy windowed front ends and icons?
>
>Hold that any true program runs from the command line?
>
>Man, have I got a deal for you *g*
>
>
>Two Short Planks software announces the next version of TRTOOLS, a set of
>command line utilities for Traveller.
>
>Version 0.93 of TRTOOLS covers the following:
>
>* Sector and subsector mapping
>* Hard Times effects on sector data
>* TNE Collapse effects on sector data
>* Regression of sectors from M:1100 to M:0
>
>and comes complete with source code (in Pascal 'messycode' format)...
>
>How much for such an ill-omened piece of software, you ask?
>
>ABSOLUTELY BUGGER ALL...all I ask is that you send me bug reports, so I can
>fix problems as they arise...
>
>Version 0.93 will be ready on about 14 days...email me to reserve your copy
>NOW !
>Michael T. Bailey (mickb@opera.iinet.net.au)
>
>"F**k you, I'm sick!"
>			Hunter S. Thompson
>
>
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:48:26 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: T4 tasks, again (sorry)

At 12:55 pm 06/23/97 +0100, you wrote:
>Allow me to summarise:
>
>1) Marc is very keen on the skill + stat approach, still; there is 
>some real-world logic to it as well.
>
>2) Many TMLers feel that *given the current character generation 
>methods* stats are over-rated by a fair bit relative to skills.
>
>3) There are a number of suggestions for skills reducing the 
>difficulty of tasks (or increasing it).  This is based on the idea 
>that skill is more than "enhancement of natural ability", which is a 
>CT idea still manifest in T4 in places (Medic-2 bonuses, etc.)
>
>4) All the task systems have problems.
>
>5) All things being equal, the D3 should go.
>
>
>I am going to accept 1) as a starting point.  Marc has good reasons 
>for his decisions, and it's his call to make.  The Great Task System 
>Debate (TGTSD) is therefore redefined as: how can T4.1 be adjusted to 
>take the other points into account?

	Bit presumptuous to redefine what we all want to talk about? I disagree
with the starting point, myself; I have never heard Marc come out and say
that since the debate began. And arguing in favor of it doesn't mean you
necessarily support it. I've often continued to argue pros about something
I no longer fully agree with, simply to ensure I have covered all the bases ...
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:22:08 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: Putting Traveller on an upward trend

At 07:05 am 06/24/97 GMT, you wrote:
>The real trick would be shrinking the minigame down to the size of a
>deck of Magic cards (I'm kidding :)

	Actually, I was thinking the other night of a series of cards I'd really
like to see (and I abhor CCGs): "special encounters," sparked by a
description of a critter in an SF book. I envision a deck of cards, each
with a detailed creature on it, including stats, artwork, behaviour, etc.
Then, when you roll (or decide) an encounter, instead of having to haul out
the main book and generate the creature, or pull out a laboriously-created
world-specific encounter table, you shuffle the deck, and let the players
"pick a card, any card ..."

	It would be a great way to harness some of the creativity here on the
list, of the folks who don't have time to write up full adventures, or
detailed economics rules, or lavishly-detailed ship designs. And those
people don't have time to come up with all kinds of novel,
"sense-of-wonder," critters.

	In addition to animal encounters, you could throw in a few terrain
encounters. A separate deck could be kept for NPC encounters. Done
properly, you could even use the cards in some sort of stand-alone game,
while keeping them useful with Traveller.

	Something like this is what I'd like to do for my own universe, anyway.
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:46:46 -0600
From: "David J. Golden" <goldendj@pcisys.net>
Subject: Re: T4 Task Rationale

At 05:02 pm 06/24/97 -0800, you wrote:
>Tue, 24 Jun 1997 12:15:16 MET, "Volker A. Greimann" <GREI5001@uni-trier.de>
>>- -> Well, a Dex 7 is that average rolled, before any additional
>>- -> character advancement.  That means that  a stat of 7 is
>>- -> below average.  I would say that someone on the clutzy
>>- -> side of average is not doctor material...
>
>>No, it's the average of the general pop allright. You forgot about the
>>aging effects! So the older people and the children are going to have
>>lower stats than those "on their peak". That reduces the average back
>>to about 7. (Also don't forget many characters never roll on the stat
>>improv. tables, choosing skill improvement instead!
>
>Well, this is debatable since you dexterity doesn't tend
>to decrease until late in life (after retirement) and children
>aren't usually doctors.  In any case, even if it were the
>case I would say that someone who is totally mediocre is
>hardly doctor material either (not without a lot of training
>at least.

	I disagree. Dexterity is probably a very UNimportant skill for most
doctors. My dad's oncologist is valuable because of his experience and
knowledge--he'll never touch a scalpel. The ER resident who saw my dad
recently didn't need his dexterity for anything other than maneuvering
around the electrode leads--again, his intelligence and ability to put
together clues to diagnose the basic problem were important. The
gastroenterologist who confirmed and sharpened the diagnosis of a
perforated esophagus not only didn't need his dexterity, but wouldn't ever
have performed the surgery. The thoracic surgeon who was consulted is the
ONLY person for whom Dexterity might have mattered ... except they decided
not to operate. Again, it was skill, intelligence, education. Going on in
this vein, the opthalmologist who checks my eyes doesn't need high dex. The
general practitioner who might put in minor stitches needs decent
dexterity, but not really high. And on, and on, and on. I'd much rather
have my dad's emergency handled by somebody with a wide base of knowledge,
understanding of how the body works, and the ability to put seemingly
unrelated pieces of the puzzle together, than some magic-fingers. The magic
fingers would have jumped on the obvious diagnosis of heart attack (chest
pain, left side spreading up to left shoulder and arm, numbness of the left
arm/hand), missing the other indication (abdominal pain). Instead, the
doctor analyzed EVERYTHING, and put the pieces together correctly
(perforated esophagus leading to air, food, and fluids contaminating the
chest cavity; critical danger of septic shock and massive infection of all
major organs).

	And he could have done that confined to a wheelchair like Stephen Hawking.
- -- Dave Golden                  http://www.pcisys.net/~goldendj --
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:48:06 -0600
From: Erwin Fritz <efritz@glja.com>
Subject: MT Task Library

Douglas E. Berry wrote:
> 
> At 08:52 AM 6/24/97 -0400, Volker A. Greimann wrote:
> >
> >Count me for the MT system.
> 
> Put me on that list also.  MT was the best task system Traveller ever had.
> I will accept (and expect) a revision of the current system, but it should
> have all the nice tidbits that made building up my MT task library enjoyable.
> 

And what Task Library would this be? It sounds like you've built up a 
lengthy list of tasks! Feel like sharing the document with the TML? I'm
still running MT (and will be until T4 is mature enough) and am always
on
the lookout for stuff to make my life easier.
- -- 
Erwin Fritz
Unix/NT/LAN Guy
Gilbert Laustsen Jung Associates Ltd.
http://www.glja.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 25 Jun 1997 02:14:27 GMT
From: jlindsay@direct.ca (James Lindsay)
Subject: Re: T4 Task Rationale

On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:02:51 -0800, David P. Summers wrote:

> Tue, 24 Jun 1997 12:15:16 MET, "Volker A. Greimann" <GREI5001@uni-trier.de>
> >- -> Well, a Dex 7 is that average rolled, before any additional
> >- -> character advancement.  That means that  a stat of 7 is
> >- -> below average.  I would say that someone on the clutzy
> >- -> side of average is not doctor material...
> 
> >No, it's the average of the general pop allright. You forgot about the
> >aging effects! So the older people and the children are going to have
> >lower stats than those "on their peak". That reduces the average back
> >to about 7. (Also don't forget many characters never roll on the stat
> >improv. tables, choosing skill improvement instead!
> 
> Well, this is debatable since you dexterity doesn't tend
> to decrease until late in life (after retirement) and children
> aren't usually doctors.  In any case, even if it were the
> case I would say that someone who is totally mediocre is
> hardly doctor material either (not without a lot of training
> at least.

Yes, but is that training that grants "skills" or training that grants
"stat bonuses"?

James W. Lindsay     Vancouver, British Columbia
  "http://www.prosperoimaging.com/ground_zero"

"Give me the strength to change the things I can,
    the grace to accept the things I cannot,
         and a great big bag of money."

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 23:02:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: CardSharks@aol.com
Subject: Re: Task System, Game Design, etc.

In a message dated 97-06-24 22:06:44 EDT, you write:

<< 
 Yours Respectfully,
 
 Mike Lee
  >>

Thank you for your email. What I have to trust is that after I come to a
decision, I will be able to withstand the flames.

Meanwhile, I had a reasoned (voice) discussion with Kenneth Bearden about
tasks, and it helped a lot. For one thing, he expressed the opinion that T41
(being a complete rewrite) (correct me if I misstate you Kenneth) deals with
a wider range of skill levels than Classic Traveller, making at least some of
the discussion moot.

Meanwhile, thanks for your kind words.

Marc Miller

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End of Traveller-digest V1997 #1472
***********************************
